• Randy Vallis
    38
    I saw this video and thought I would share it. I found it very informative https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JMf4tBAeMIE
  • Steve S
    31
    Not really, she is discussing out of date technology. No one in RVs uses Lithium Ion, we are using Lithium Iron Phosphate (LiFePO4) batteries which are far safer than Lithium Ion. Will Prowse is the best resource that has excellent videos on Solar and battery technologies. Pippi Petersen just doesn't know … plain and simple.

    Will Prowes's Channel ... Enjoy
  • Greg F
    159
    Oh boy. I had to check when this video was made. Hard to believe this was from an industry expert in 2019.
  • Steve S
    31
    Clearly, the "expert" hasn't bothered to keep up with the times. Shhhhh … we mustn't let Ray view the video … he'll want to get rid of his brand new Lithium Ion batteries and go back to his AGM battery bank. But, if Ray does that, he'll be the first one in history to have done it. Poor Pippi drank just as much coolaid and simply doesn't realize what a disservice her video is doing.
  • RVsolar
    184
    I call dibs on Ray's battery's LOL.
  • Randy Vallis
    38
    Thanks, after seeing this video I knew where to find the rights of this. You see so many videos on this and when someone claims to have done thousands of solar conversions it made me wonder why would you install this given the restrictions, made no sense. Rv
  • Rush and Lola
    113
    Very good video. A lot of info to look at objectively. Not narrow minded.
  • Rich Nyquist
    0
    The video is all one sided. A discussion between Mark and the boys from Battleborn would be more educational
  • Greg F
    159
    I would actually love to have a conversation with John Goodenough the pioneer of Lithium batteries. There is quite a bit of research going into solid state batteries which could be a game changer in battery tech. Lighter, cheaper, more environment friendly and more powerful than current LFP technology.
  • Eddie Aileen
    89
    So am I not keeping up with the times with my old antedated system? Our system is used to fulltime Off-Grid 95% of the time. (Just ask Ray, he knows!) Money has a large part to do with the equipment a person can put in a solar power system set-up. You have a smaller system, so less power storage. I have a large system, and a "Bigger Truck", It works flawlessly and wonderful for us.
    I'm seeing a lot of one side coming from those who think you can only do it with one battery type........that is just not true.
    Lead is not dead, a good 90% of all "Off-Grid" Solar Power Systems are using some form of Lead acid battery bank. There are also some Lithium Iron Phosphate systems. As always it comes down to what you can afford at the time you go to install your solar system.
    Also just to get your stats correct, discharging of only 50% on lead acid batteries, that depends on the battery. The Trojan T-105 RE & L-16 RE battery has shown it can be discharged down to 20% DOD with out permanent damage. Lithium batteries do have more life cycles, it comes down to how deep your wallet is.........Pippi is just sharing her view on the whole power storage idea, no reason to sling mug at a nice girl.........................................................
  • Ray
    445
    Carbon Foam!

  • Eddie Aileen
    89
    Good one! :wink:
    Granddad told me "Son, there's more than one way to skin a cat!'
    Rush and I had been looking at carbon foam batteries at one time.
    Happy Trails...Pal!!!
  • RVsolar
    184
    Wow very nice
  • Steve S
    31
    Absolutely nothing wrong with what you're using - I've never stated in any forum that lead acid/AGM battery systems are bad, not once.

    Note that this is an RV forum and my comments will always be from that perspective.

    However, the OP's post of the video link … lots wrong with the content in that video. Pippi has done a disservice to her viewers by not doing proper research and seeking out both sides. When she doesn't, and, publicly posts such biased one-sided drivel, she gets corrected, by me and others. She sought out one person's opinion. Based on his business model - of course, he'll state outdated facts, misinformation, etc. What do I know? I'm an Electronic Engineering Technologist that worked for Saft Batteries … a company that has been around for over 100 years - much longer than the so-called expert Pippi interviewed.

    In RVs, LiFePo4 Lithium batteries are used. For us RVers, when we mention Lithiums, LiFePO4 is what we refer to, not Lithium Ion. Again, shows how out of touch and biased the "video expert" being interviewed is. He talks about safety … again, conveniently neglecting the thousands of people injured/killed by lead acid batteries exploding! Don't believe me? Just look it up, the true facts are not hiding … Pippi didn't do that.

    Nice girls make mistakes; she truly doesn't know anything about Lithiums and I stand by that comment! That's not mud slinging, that's a fact. Now, many of her viewers think Lithiums are bad and dangerous to use. Far from reality.

    We all make decisions on what we can/can't afford. My Lithiums can charge faster, use a smaller solar setup, allow me to do boondocking comfortably and still be able to charge my eBike. But, these same Lithiums are now in their 2nd RV. Wonder how many RVers swap over their AGM battery banks when they buy another RV?? Again, something the "expert" never talks about. If you change out a battery before it's time, the cost effectiveness goes down. I bet you want to get the most out of your off-grid batteries, don't you? Would I use AGMs in an off-grid setup over Lithiums? - of course I would.

    I am not aware of a single person that had AGMs, replaced them with LiFePO4 batteries and went back to AGMs … speaks volumes about the viability and safety of LiFePO4 batteries.

    Anyone reading this that wants to learn about solar and Lithium batteries, this is the channel to use - he does his research and tells it like it is:

    Will Prowse

    Cheers, Steve
  • Ray
    445
    The video seemed to be a little one-sided, THe LiFePO the bulk of RVers are installing isn't the end all be all but definitely not as scary as they made out. I know Eddie installs a lot of them for RVers and wouldn't do it if they were that big of a safety hazard.

    The way I see it so far costs and temperature considerations are the biggest drawbacks. Interesting when they were talking about big loads they didn't mention the Peukart effect. A big plus for lithium along with my two favorites so far weight and not having to worry about recharging to 100% on a consistent basis.

    Looks like Trojan has a new video out on the subject



    The RV Geeks have a decent take on the subject as well



    and this is a pretty good article from a marine perspective - https://marinehowto.com/lifepo4-batteries-on-boats/
  • Eddie Aileen
    89
    :confused: Quote "Poor Pippi drank just as much coolaid and simply doesn't realize what a disservice her video is doing." That's a bit snide, if you just said that the content in that video was off it would not be "Slinging mud".
    I kinda know that LiFePo4 Lithium batteries are what "We" put in "Some" RV's. I may have installed one or two of those?
    One of the largest, and most overlooked, limitations on LiFePO4 batteries is temperature. Many cannot put their battery bank within the heated/cooled area of the coach. I do know of a fulltiming couple with a 5th wheel that had to switch back to AGM's from LiFePO4 batteries because of this reason. They did not want to have all of the extra tech to keep them warm/cool.
    I'm not against LiFePO4, AGM or Lead Acid wet cell batteries, each have their place and use. One is not overall better than the other, each have their limitations. I will say I would take a top of the line lead acid wet-cell over a Lithium no name battery.
    Our next batteries may be the ones Ray has just pointed out. FireFly Carbon Foam batteries fit our system requirements better then LiFePO4, but have some of the same,"or close", charging characteristics to those of lithium.
    I'm still doing research and looking to visit with sailing fulltime cruisers that have used them in "Real World" service for extended off-grid periods.
    Just remember what it is all about...........................................Happy Trails!!! :wink:
  • Greg F
    159
    A big plus for lithium along with my two favorites so far weight and not having to worry about recharging to 100% on a consistent basis./quote]

    These are the huge wins for us. I will add how much faster they accept a charge. Charging primarily or only with solar capturing as much of the suns energy as possible is a big advantage.
  • RVsolar
    184
    We have both old Chevy volt 12v @400amps for the 5wheel then 2-6volt@1253amps just for the wife 's oxygen centrator. I find the Chevy battery's do charge faster only have 2-@360w sailor panel going to them . But the big reds do a good job I have 6- panels @ 360w feeding those big boys. Everything is good if the sun is out LOL keep the sunny side up!
  • Steve S
    31
    Hi Eddie …
    "Poor Pippi drank just as much coolaid and simply doesn't realize what a disservice her video is doing." That's a bit snide, if you just said that the content in that video was off it would not be "Slinging mud"Eddie Aileen
    . You do know what "drinking coolaid" represents? Someone blindly following without question. A definite disservice to her viewers. Pippi never questioned the "facts" being spewed forth by her "expert."

    I kinda know that LiFePo4 Lithium batteries are what "We" put in "Some" RV's. I may have installed one or two of those?Eddie Aileen
    Well, a lot of Pippi's viewers sure didn't and still don't if they haven't revisited the video.

    One of the largest, and most overlooked, limitations on LiFePO4 batteries is temperature. Many cannot put their battery bank within the heated/cooled area of the coach. I do know of a fulltiming couple with a 5th wheel that had to switch back to AGM's from LiFePO4 batteries because of this reason. They did not want to have all of the extra tech to keep them warm/cool.Eddie Aileen
    When was this and who? You are aware they do sell LiFePO4 batteries that no longer have this limitation right? Because I sure do.

    I will say I would take a top of the line lead acid wet-cell over a Lithium no name battery.Eddie Aileen
    So would I.

    Yes, I remember what it's all about … not using your YouTube influence to lead your viewers astray.

    BTW, those carbon foam batteries do sound interesting … start a post on them if you are so inclined.

    Cheers, Steve
  • Eddie Aileen
    89
    I get it, you are a LiFePO4 guy. :up:
    I'm for what ever works the best all around for the application.
    Quote" (You are aware they do sell LiFePO4 batteries that no longer have this limitation right? Because I sure do.")
    I have run my T-105 RE wet cell bank in -35-F below 0 weather many times in the past for prolonged periods. There is no LiFePO4 battery that can operate in that cold of temps with out some type of heating system. this is extra energy that is wasted to heat the battery. Also very hot temperatures can reduce life cycles quicker than other battery types.
    But what do I know I'm not a Electronic Engineering Technologist.
    (I'm more of the "Boots On The Ground" kinda guy.)
    I had no idea about the "drinking coolaid" metaphor, must be a regional thing,or I'm just out of the loop?
    I've put in a lot of systems with all types of power storage,it's just one part of the equation,lets get past the darn battery and talk about the rest of the system............ :confused:
  • RVsolar
    184
    Hi I have 8 360w solar panels three solar charge controllers 2- Victrons (100v-50amp Bluetooth) and a midnight classic 150 I have addiction to solar.
  • Eddie Aileen
    89
    Cool set-up! We have 1600-watts with two 60-amp MorningStar TriStar solar charge controllers, on 900 AH battery bank. Two Trimetric battery monitors, and two Magnum 2000 watt inverters.
    Happy Trails Friends!!!
  • Greg F
    159
    "in -35-F below 0 weather many times in the past for prolonged periods"

    :gasp: Great googly moogly! Why? Just why?

    We are too whimpy for that. When it gets down to where it *might* freeze overnight we start scouting for a new place to live. Since I retired my goal is shorts 365.

    This is about as cold as we get, a surprise cold snap in the desert staying at Gilbert Ray campground near Tuscon AZ last winter. Fun for a day but the novelty wears off quickly for us. :grimace:

    0qprxrmpujvcb6pm.jpg
  • RVsolar
    184
    very nice

    I would love to but being Canadian we get some funny weather
    Right now we are only getting day time of highs of low 50 f to night
    25f can't leave for USA yet not til after thanksgiving October 14 LOL
    Then it's wheels up.
  • Greg F
    159
    Well, 25f is a lot better than -35f. That's just crazy brutal in an RV.

    I scratched my head there for a second. Thanksgiving in October? I forgot you Canucks cook your bird in the middle of October.

    So you head south into the US in 10 days or so?
  • RVsolar
    184
    yes if I had my way would have gone all ready DW family you know lol
  • Greg F
    159
    Right, we take off after the family x-mas festivities this year. :roll:
  • Eddie Aileen
    89
    Here is -35-F below 0 several years back at the ranch in Wyoming.
    Happy Trails!!!
    ttnikgnxf1oz82vi.jpg
    gu90uzo2d9xq8o4y.jpg
  • Greg F
    159
    Better you than me brother! :strong:
  • Kimberly
    17
    Could it be she just said "Lithium Ion" because it's easier to say?
    :chin:
    Nevermind.
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